enigma <enigma@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote in message
news:<Xns946D6135BF48Denigmaempirenet@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>...
> define "normal childhood".
An environment which a child has the op****tunity to grow and
positively contribute to his/her own society. Op****tunity being the
key word here. If the child's playmates are limited due to the fact
that "their mum looks weird" or the child receives rejection from
his/her own peers due to the actions of his parents, then the child's
op****tunities are limited. I am using the original author's
perspective, which in my opinion, is the less of her worries.
> what *exactly* do you mean by 'tone it down a few notches'? do
> you mean everyone *must* look like the standard TV unrealistic
> view of society?
I'm saying that she should throw some color in her wardrobe to better
fit in. She doesn't have to wear designer manufactured clothing, but
constantly wearing black is not a good thing.
> what you don't seem to understand is that the society you are
> insisting we need to fit into is, & always has been, made up
> of various subcultures. there *is* not & never has been a
> homogeneous society, especially not in the US.
Regardless of the subculture that comprises her society, I don't
believe the traits associated to the gothic lifestyle will benefit the
child. Name the traits of being goth that you believe will help the
child to grow in a positive manner and I will take the time to argue
your points. In other words, what makes you color your hair purple and
wear black clothes and how does that help your child.
> i was a Cold War baby. i was born in the McCarthy era. you
> know what? my outwardly very "normal" looking parents were
> doing subversive things like learning to speak & read
> Russian... i learned early that it was just fine to not fit
> in.
I take the above to mean that "not fitting in" means being able to
think for yourself and to have your own beliefs. I sup****t that 100
percent. However, according to you, your parents didn't go waving a
Russian flag outside and wearing anti-american clothes and naming you
"Beria". If they did, you probably would have been beaten up, shun
upon in school and society and your op****tunities would have been
limited in life if you lived in a non-communist society. You know we
are comparing Political views verses social (or anti-social) views.
>i have no idea why *you* think everyone should be Sam &
> Suzy Whitebread.
I'm saying is that if you live in Sam and Suzie's society, don't put
yourself in a position that will harm your child's potential. My only
concern is that the gothic lifestyle has nothing to offer a child that
can be seen as positive. Like I mentioned earlier, if you disagree,
list the positive traits and I will argue them.
> and you never answered my rebuttal to this. i suspect it's
> because you realize your position is tenuous at best, or that
> you really don't have a clue what you're talking about.
Sorry, I didn't have the time. I apologize. Assuming your rebuttal was
the following:
"first, yes, i do believe the current 'norms' of society are
wrong. i do not intend to raise a brainless consumer who is
willing to bow before the yoke of authority. if you think
that's a problem maybe you should examine your own
indoctrination a little more closely.
second, a subculture, by definition, is a subset of a
culture. a subculture takes those parts of the norm of society
that works & leaves the parts that do not. subcultures also
live in flux, as does most of society (the Victorians would be
shocked by current society, for example, even though it is a
direct decendant of thier social norms)."
Here is my response:
Your argument states that a normal (aka majority) member of society is
in the wrong because he/she is a "brainless consumer who is willing to
bow before the yoke of authority." Whether that is true or not, is
irrelevant. It's your perception of the people around you. You choose
to live in that society and by outwardly rebelling against it, you
will not help your child. I too, will teach my children to think for
themselves and not base their decision on the actions of the majority.
However, I will not hinder their potential by being "goth". You don't
have to wear black and color your hair purple to state that you're a
free thinker and not a "brainless consumer".
Also, unless you live in a small village in Africa (or something
similar) where you do not have to purchase objects with monetary
means, you are considered a consumer. Keeping that in mind, one could
say that a person is "brainless" if they paid money to make their hair
turn purple. ;)
> just how many children have you raised, anyway?
I have not experienced raising a child and seeing that child grow up
to be successful (whatever that might mean to him/her). I'm still in
the process.
> you're still full of ****.
Thanks! And your beliefs are nothing but smells of flowers basking in
the rays of the sun...wait that's not goth! ;)
> lee
Regards...
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